You’ve Been Hired… Into a Scam

Imagine you received an offer to your dream job…except you didn’t. 

Have a wild tale that needs to be heard? Fill out the form, and you might just hear your story featured on our “Scam, Scam” segment!

Music by DJ Jayo.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

They want my money.

SPEAKER_02 0:12

This is Unnigerian Prince, the podcast where we talk about scams from everywhere else.

SPEAKER_03 0:21

Good morning, Noms.

SPEAKER_01 0:22

Good morning, Google. How are you doing? Girl, I've been good actually, considering, you know, all around us. But I've been hanging in there, I've been trying to go to the gym more. Good. By trying, I mean, I've made it once in the last eight days, but you know, God still loves me. I'm just pushing through. How are you doing?

SPEAKER_03 0:49

I'm good. The weather has been very lovely here, so I'm very grateful for that. I feel like life is worth living again.

SPEAKER_01 0:59

To be completely honest. I know. That's how it is in the northeast. Like the sun comes out again, and you're like, oh my god, I can stay alive. One day above 70, all of the city is outside.

SPEAKER_03 1:11

Literally skirts and dresses.

SPEAKER_01 1:13

Nobody, anything that goes beyond your knees is against the law. Like when the sun is out. But also, we saw each other last week, didn't we? Because I was in DC, which is really nice. It was nice.

SPEAKER_03 1:26

And we stayed up to like 1 a.m. yapping.

SPEAKER_01 1:29

Just gossiping and causing general havoc. It was delicious. And then it was time to go home, and I was sad. I was like, I can't believe I can't stay here all night and just say nonsense. It was great. But I will see you soon.

SPEAKER_03 1:47

Yes, more of that to come throughout the summer for sure.

SPEAKER_01 1:50

Exactly. Alright, so, so, so back to the pod. Where are we today?

SPEAKER_03 1:56

Today, we're in a country where the main character of the movie Bend It Like Beckham is from.

SPEAKER_01 2:05

Bend It Like Beckham. I honestly have not thought about that movie in so long. And when I was younger, it was like one of my comfort films. And I thought deep down I could be good at football. I am not, but I knew I could do it. I could not. But anyway, anyway, back to Bend It Like Beckham. Where was she from? Was she from like the Middle East? That feels wrong, but was she? So you're not too far off, but think Britain and Spicy. You are so correct because my good girl was from India. Should I even say it? Should I say what we're all thinking? You should. You should. The bits are at it again.

SPEAKER_03 2:46

They're always at it. And to our British listeners, please, we love y'all. So don't run away.

SPEAKER_01 2:52

But I don't know what else to say. The shoe fits every single time. Every time. And I can say it.

SPEAKER_03 2:58

My fiance is British. That is true. That is true. I always get surprised whenever he talks. I'm just like, I forget that you're from the UK. It's a surprise every time.

SPEAKER_01 3:09

It's too. Like half the time, like I'm like, oh. Oh. I'll have to tell the story. The other day, me, him, and Ugo were on FaceTime, and we'd been on FaceTime for like a solid like three minutes. And then she goes, Ugh. And I was like, what? I forget all the time that he's British. She was genuinely shocked. She was like, What is that noise? Anyway, we love the Brits. We love the Brits. We do. We do love you guys. You guys were there. Exactly. We were there last summer. We've been there for ages. We love y'all.

SPEAKER_03 3:51

Alright, let's jump right into the story for today. Imagine quitting your full-time, wall-paying job because Harvard University hired you as a professor. You've told your closest friends, your family, perhaps even the entire internet. Everyone is super excited for you to go out and begin this new chapter of your life. Now, imagine finding out that Harvard University has never heard of you.

unknown 4:25

Oh my god. What?

SPEAKER_01 4:31

I would sincerely lose my mind.

SPEAKER_03 4:36

No, legitimately. I would have to be placed into a straitjacket immediately.

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Ugh, you have verbal power of attorney to take me off the street. Put me in the bigger, take me straight to Yabba Left because what are you talking about?

SPEAKER_03 4:52

I need to be off the streets. Let's hope it doesn't get to that point. But I have noted that in the back of my mind. So today I'm going to be telling you the story about how a phantom group of scammers successfully targeted an elite group of high-profile female journalists and political commentators in India.

SPEAKER_01 5:17

Alright. First question right out the gate because I'm already mad. I'm already pissed off. So you said female journalists. So we're talking about people who deal with the media often. These are people who are fact checkers, right? Like they verify facts, they're very skeptical. So I'm already a little bit like, why would you choose these people as targets? Because they're they're skeptics, right?

SPEAKER_03 5:46

Right, no, exactly. Like they are 100% professional skeptics.

SPEAKER_01 5:51

So how would they get reeled into a fake job offer? Because I'm assuming they're gonna like I mean, I'm sure this is elaborate, so I don't mean to like minimize it, but I'm just like, right?

SPEAKER_03 6:01

Like what I'm Yeah, no, I I'm with you. I'm with you. And it's honestly a great question, and one that I had too, because I saw the headline of journalists and scam, and I said, something's not clicking. Right. But I think that to understand, you know, what's happening is for us to look at the mechanics of the scam, right? The first known targets were actually approached back in mid-2019. One of them was Rohini Singh, who was a prominent freelance journalist who is very well known for breaking highly critical stories about powerful men in the Indian government, and she works as a contributor to an online publication called The Wire that is critical of the Indian government and the current ruling party, which, from my research, has a bend towards Hindu nationalism. Another target was Zainab Sikander, who was a well-known political commentator who campaigns against discrimination towards Muslims, which is apparently a growing problem under this current government as well. And there are other targets, but these are just two, to give you a flavor of who our scammers are going after.

SPEAKER_01 7:15

Right, so high profile sounds like politically verbal targets from jump.

SPEAKER_03 7:23

Yep, so they aimed for very high-profile targets from the very beginning. And the scammers actually approached them on Twitter. A user named Tosef Ahmad introduced himself as being a master student at the Harvard Kennedy School. Now, of course, this is a fake persona. Anyway, he strikes up a casual conversation, builds some rapport, and then just you know casually mentions an invitation to an exclusive all expenses paid media conference at Harvard.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

That would have been the point he needed to get off my line because I'm not gonna hold you very sloppy work. Like this is an F. Like F F F F F F F. Maybe it's because I've done a few of these like university conferences type of things. They will not give you a dime, okay, to come speak. I think we used to be able to pay like performers if they were coming to close out. Think like the Harvard Business School Africa Conference, right? Or the one Wharton does, or the one Columbia does. At the end, you invite like Tiwa Savage or somebody to perform, you pay them. Everybody else, you don't have the coins for. So all expenses means Harvard is gonna pay for your flight from India to come speak at a conference. Get off my line. Don't piss me off. Get off my line. I am completely with you. I don't understand. Yeah, D minus work, F work, D minus, F.

SPEAKER_03 8:53

It's not a great scam so far. And Tosif eventually connects Rohini and Zaynab to his supposed classmate, Alex Hirschman, another fake persona student. Yeah. And he does this to get the ball rolling on bringing them to this media conference. But Alex emails them from a standard Gmail account, not at a Harvard.edu address.

SPEAKER_01 9:17

Rookie behavior again. So I feel like I'm assuming again, these are journalists, so they know to verify certain things. Because right now, it just sounds like a bunch of people playing in my inbox. So I'm like, wrap it up, go go clock in at Walmart, leave me alone.

SPEAKER_03 9:40

Yeah, no, it's for sure giving get off the field.

unknown 9:43

Like I'm totally with you.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

Like, come back where you've developed. Oh no, don't come back, but you know what I mean? Actually, go to jail, but you know.

SPEAKER_03 9:52

Yep. But to add to this, both of these guys are calling and texting the women from phone numbers with the United Arab Emirates country code. Yep. Like if someone calls or texts you from a Dubai number claiming to be affiliated with Harvard, isn't that an immediate red flag, if not a deal breaker for you? But I'm not I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_01 10:13

I will say this though, I think this is actually the most believable part so far. Because as an international student, when you first start, to be fair, the international student's office is going to encourage you to get a US phone number, like almost immediately because it's very expensive, otherwise, very difficult to get things done otherwise. But if you're still maybe in the process of doing that, andor like your local number is still tied to your WhatsApp, for example, I can see how that would make sense. It's not great, it'll be like a bit bizarre, especially if it's not the start of the semester, but it's the most believable thing so far, and it's still unbelievable. But I kind of get it, I kind of get that one.

SPEAKER_03 11:00

Okay, that's a fair point because I do remember reading that if you are targeting professionals in India, a UAE phone number apparently isn't entirely alien because there is a massive South Asian diaspora in the Gulf region. And Zaina, the political commentator, she actually rationalized it herself. You know, she figured he might be an international student, to your point, with family or business connections to Dubai.

SPEAKER_01 11:28

Not me and Zaina both getting scammed. My girl filled in the blanks. I mean, it makes sense. I I just don't think that in and of itself is enough to convince somebody who should be generally skeptical, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 11:47

Yeah. Okay, so to be fair to Zaynab and Rohini, they did eventually listen to their guts. So they didn't fall for the whole thing. When official invitations from the actual Harvard Dean for the event never materialized, they said, Don't know what you have going on over here, but we're good. And they bailed.

SPEAKER_01 12:07

Thank God. Yes, Zaynab. Yes, those are my girls. Exactly. You look at the facts and you say, It's giving nothing. I appreciate this. We love when people escape. We do love. We love an escape.

SPEAKER_03 12:22

But I do want to note that these scammers use a tactic known as spearfishing. And it's essentially a scam that's entirely designed for one specific individual. And it uses details gleaned from their actual life to build a really plausible reality. And the scammers overwhelmed their targets with this, let's call it logistical flattery. Right? They sent them messages constantly asking things like, is this room okay for you? Is this hotel fine for you? So Rohini and Zaynab, they really did sort of have a reason to buy in.

SPEAKER_01 12:57

Right. That part is really clever too, because it creates this sense of like obligation. If somebody is really like getting into the detail of your booking, your hotel, your flights, your taxi, do you like this car? Do you need a four-seater, a six-seater? Like, you feel like, oh, this must really exist because the devil's in the details, kind of like you're like, oh, this is really real. Now I like to think somebody like me that's super high touch and is like, does the hotel have early early check-in? Is there a rooftop bar? Like, I will eventually catch on. But I can see how that would create a sense of trust.

SPEAKER_03 13:35

Yeah, it feels like someone is trying to be helpful to you, which in a lot of the stories that we've talked about so far on this podcast, the scammers aren't necessarily trying to be helpful per se. Right. Right. But I do have to let you know that the scammers didn't stop there. They just took notes and improved.

SPEAKER_01 13:57

Dang it. I've been saying I get come back when you have a better scam, and I didn't really mean it. And it sounds like they are on their way. But I bet they got rid of that stupid Gmail account, didn't they? Girl, you know they did.

SPEAKER_03 14:09

You know they did. And to your point, the scammers will always come back unless they're locked up. Right. They have no reason for course correction. That's good consequences. That's correct. But this all brings us now to late November 2019 when they target Needy Razdan, who is the most well-known victim of this scam. And for listeners who may not be familiar with the Indian media landscape, Nidi Razdan was a superstar of sorts. She anchored the New Delhi television's 9 o'clock news, so she was a familiar face to millions of people. But it seems like she was a bit burnt out and was experiencing exhaustion. She had just covered a grueling year of elections, massive geopolitical tensions with Pakistan, and she was dealing with relentless, intense online trolls. So, yes, she was at the peak of her career, but it also seems like she was desperately seeking an exit strategy.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

Yeah, that seems like a lot. I feel like the work part, or as a journalist, there's always a sense of volatility with the elections and the geopolitical tensions. So, like I would expect that that's sort of a constant. The online trolls part sounds like she was going through a lot personally. I have a lot of empathy for that, right? Because then you're just like, I need to get out of here. I need to be at a different job. And I feel like that urgency, that like desperation, that is recipe for error all the time. All the time. And my heart goes out to her because it seems like a lot. Like this feeling of like, if you're in a public eye, like she clearly was, nine o'clock news means like peak time news, right? You're there's so much feedback on you and who you are as a person. And I can see how, like, at some point you're like, Thank you, I've had enough.

SPEAKER_03 16:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:06

I get it. I completely get that.

unknown 16:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:10

And remember, this is India. I think India what has a population of like 1.2 billion people. Like, she has a lot of eyes on her. And so what happens next is a student from Harvard University named Melissa Reeve, of course, fake persona, of course, fake student, but they reach out to Needy about a Harvard media seminar. Needy is like, yeah, you know what? That sounds interesting. So Melissa introduces her to her old friend, Tossif.

SPEAKER_01 16:41

Tossif, no! No, no!

SPEAKER_03 16:47

At the scene of the crime again. And Tossif casually mentions that there might be a journalism teaching job available at Harvard. And Nidi says, yeah, she's interested in the job. I mean, it couldn't have come at a better time, right? For one, it's Harvard, but also, she wants to leave this toxic environment. And I almost wonder if the scammers sensed that or somehow knew this information.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

That's interesting. I feel like it would make sense that they know, right? Because of what you said before about the spear fishing, they get these very detailed things about you. And if you one thing I noticed, um, with my friends or even like just people online, they don't know they're doing it. If you're posting frequently, we know your state of mind. Yeah. Like you think we don't know, you think it's just your highlight reel. But if it's frequent enough, some of it is leaking out. We can kind of tell. And it probably wasn't too hard for them to maybe connect those dots a little bit more than you would think, you know.

SPEAKER_03 17:50

That's a very, very good observation, honestly. I don't post often on social media, like I don't post on Twitter anymore. I barely have posted on my stories this year, but I watch people's stories. I just they're gleaning, looking at what's happening in their lives. And I'm like, huh. I'm able to deduce a lot of information from what's happening here. So it's definitely illuminating for sure. But I do want to let you know that, you know, to get back to the scam, and you might be happy to know this. Like people who have found some sense, our scammers actually went and purchased the URL, HarvardCareer.com.

SPEAKER_01 18:26

For the record, I'm not happy to know. I love to see growth, but not as scammers. I would like people to know, I'm not happy to know. But I would say though, not gonna hold you, that dot com would have given me pause still. Because it's an educational institution in America. Now, now I I would expect to see Harvard.edu, right? Because that's how it works. Although I'm also sensitive to the fact that in many other countries, the.edu.com thing is not really that big of a thing. Not all the universities actually use the education domain. So I'm aware of that. Um and maybe she was also just missing that, but I'm just like, me seeing Harvard.com, get off my line.

SPEAKER_03 19:23

Yeah. You know, that's a really good point about other countries and the domains that they're using for addresses. That's that's a very good one, and one that I hadn't considered. And I really just honestly think that the prestige of Harvard just gets to people, right? They let their guard down.

SPEAKER_01 19:42

That's definitely.

SPEAKER_03 19:44

And I think like the shoe fits. She's a very accomplished broadcast journalist. Right. And it's like, well, yeah, Harvard would reach out to someone like me to teach in, you know, to teach journalism.

SPEAKER_01 19:58

That's absolutely valid. Yeah. Now, if Harvard reached out to me to teach journalism, I would know that it was a scam. You know, but you're dealing with somebody who is on peak news in a massive country. She's earned that. And she might have even done other seminars in other universities, so this is really not that out of place. That's actually incredibly fair. That's fair.

SPEAKER_03 20:20

And Nidi is receiving emails from this very official-looking Harvard Careers domain about this job opportunity. And the scammers even go so far as to conduct a phone interview with her.

SPEAKER_01 20:33

The only thing worse than a scammer is a scammer that has time on their hands. Because what are you saying? They had nothing else. Oh my god, they like develop questions and they like ask questions. Oh, this is unfortunate.

SPEAKER_03 20:49

They had someone posing as Barat Anand, who at the time was an actual vice provost at Harvard. She did a phone interview with this individual, thinking she was interviewing with the actual Baratz. You know what she should have actually done? What?

SPEAKER_01 21:07

Insisted on a video call.

SPEAKER_00 21:09

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 21:10

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 21:11

Right? I'm with you. So Nee actually says that that is her biggest regret from this whole thing. Right? Had she insisted on a video call, the scammers would have probably dropped her as a target or would have seen that, you know, this clearly isn't Barat Anand. Um honestly, and I was like, this was before the time of deep fakes and AI videos becoming so prevalent. So it would have been very hard for the scammers to fake a video, a video call.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

No, that that makes sense. Yeah. Oh man.

SPEAKER_03 21:43

Oh, okay. And I'm sorry to let you know that I feel like the bearer of bad news, but I am sorry to let you know.

SPEAKER_01 21:51

Every time you start talking, my heart starts beating faster because I'm like, she's gonna tell me something even worse than the last thing she said.

unknown 21:59

This

SPEAKER_03 22:00

Scammers even went so far as to request her references. And each of the people needy enlisted to write a recommendation letter actually received a very official looking email from HarvardCareer.com with the link to upload a recommendation.

SPEAKER_01 22:16

Stop, stop, stop, stop, stop. One second. Because now you're scamming my friends too out of their time. And I've done some recommendations for people going to college and like masters and stuff. It's actually pretty time consuming to sit there and write those letters. And this is before, you know, Claude or Chad GPT could write most of it for you. Wow. Yeah. So that's insane. Because now other people in your network are kind of bought into this thing that and it entrenches you even more, right? Because people are asking you, oh, you know, what came of it? How did it go? Whatever. You're more invested.

SPEAKER_03 22:58

I know, and it's it's extremely annoying because if Namas, you were being scammed, and all of a sudden now I'm roped in. Somebody has to pay.

unknown 23:09

Because what?

SPEAKER_03 23:10

Why am I in it? Why am I in it?

unknown 23:12

Why am I in it?

SPEAKER_01 23:15

Oh, this is dreadful. And by the way, we're not laughing because it's fun. We're laughing because it's so incredulous. Yes. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_03 23:25

Then in February 2020, Midi was told the job was hers. And now these scammers were meticulous. Like looking at the documents that they sent to her, the level of details is just staggering. They didn't just send her an email saying, hey, you got the job. They sent a full contract with a Harvard logo laying out how she was going to be making $151,000 as her salary. And mind you, this is actually like a large pay bump from what she was already making in India as a journalist. And this contract also had things like the dental plan information, arbitration clauses, and even a promise for a faculty ID that would get her discounts at Boston area museums.

SPEAKER_01 24:12

That is insane. Okay, that is that might get me. That one a lot. Because I will say, like the discounts with your faculty ID or your student ID is simply good work in terms of the level of detail going into you know deceiving somebody about this. I feel like 151,000 is also a great number because it's round. So you're not like it's not too sp if they say like 152,345, then you're like, what's wrong with these people? But it's not too round. So it feels like, oh, there was actually a salary range, and the median was actually 151,000. Like that feels very specific and valid. My guard would definitely drop a little bit with this in particular.

unknown 25:03

Is that crazy?

SPEAKER_03 25:05

No, it's it's not crazy because I recently learned that apparently our brains are likely to associate tedious amounts of administrative paperwork with authenticity. A scammer, as you've discussed in previous episodes, wants you to act fast and send money. And that's not the case here. And that's honestly why I think it's more believable.

SPEAKER_01 25:28

Yeah, that's unnerving. It's you know what I just thought of? It's like weaponized boredom.

SPEAKER_03 25:40

That's very funny. So, okay, so weaponized boredom because of all this administrative stuff. That's actually very, very hilarious. But it is a useful way to look at it, to be fair. But anyway, Needy ends up signing the contract.

SPEAKER_01 25:55

I have never heard of anything like this in my life. Like, I'm so confused, and I still don't actually get the point of the scam. Maybe that's what I'm waiting for. Like, where do we go from here? Because she can't teach, she can't go to campus, no, she can't even get a visa. Because you she'd probably need to get a visa, right? Which she can't do. So, what is what are we doing here?

SPEAKER_03 26:22

Those are all excellent points, and I completely agree. But also, Nom, she can't do any of this because of the pandemic, right? So every university was scrambling to move online. So her classes, which were set to begin in September 2020, would be online, right? And it's so crazy to think that because the scammers had no way of foreseeing this. They didn't know that a global pandemic was going to happen when they extended this job offer to her in February of 2020. Because remember, she started the interview process or engaging with the scammers back in November of 2019, right? So they went through this whole process, extended her job offer, and now, boom, as if hell opened up because heaven's church certainly didn't open up, they're met with a global pandemic. And for Needy, it's not ideal, right? But she still is excited, right? So excited that she publicly announced this career move and announces her departure from New Delhi television after 21 years. In June 2020, she tweeted to her hundreds of thousands of followers that she was joining Harvard's Faculty of Arts and Sciences as an associate professor of journalism. Oh my no.

SPEAKER_01 27:47

I want to scream so badly. I feel like I actually have secondhand embarrassment. Like, if I could, my entire body would be pink right now. I feel so bad for her. And this is awful. And I guess I'm thinking about also like the Faculty of Arts and Sciences and Associate Professor of Journalism. She's tweeting that this out to a bunch of people. There must be a couple of Harvard people that are looking at this or seeing it, and then, oh, it's just and then her linked it. Oh, this is so bad. I really hate this for my girl.

SPEAKER_03 28:21

I hate this for her. No, I I'm with like it reached a wide audience, and absolutely Harvard people did actually see this, but they didn't do anything. And what I learned from you know, researching for this episode is that there were a few people who clocked that oh, the faculty of arts and sciences doesn't actually have a journalism program directly. The extension school does, but not what Needy is saying. But it seems like no one did everything about what was happening. And to your point about, you know, having secondhand embarrassment for her and her announcing everything that has just happened. This is why when I start a new job, I don't update my LinkedIn until at the end of the first week, you know, being in the office. Like, let me marinate first, right? Let me lock eyes with everyone.

SPEAKER_01 29:12

Let me know that this thing is real. As you should. Honestly, I still have a feeling of like every time I see somebody that posts like incoming analyst or incoming this or incoming that, because it really stresses me out. Because I'm like, never let them know your first move, babes. Get there, and then they will know you're there.

SPEAKER_03 29:35

That's so true because this actually reminds me of a story that I heard recently about a woman who moved from the East Coast to the West Coast for a job offer. She had already quit her job. She was set to begin this new job in two weeks. And they tell her, actually, we don't have the head cam for this role. We're rescinding the offer. She moved across the country. Stop it. I'm so serious.

SPEAKER_01 30:00

Stop that. It could you sue over the I don't even know. I'm suing everybody here. I don't even know if you have a legal foot to stand on, but oh my goodness. It was such an insane story to hear. That is crazy.

SPEAKER_03 30:15

Dag tour scam. Needy tweets it, and to her, all is well, right? And the things with the job are progressing. Online classes were supposed to start in September, and so she was sent multiple forms to fill out by the scammers, all on Harvard Letterhead. Think of things like her visa application, direct deposit information for her salary payments, and her medical history. And Nidia is super excited, but right before class is about to begin, she actually received an email saying that there was a slight delay related to HR and other administrative tasks because of COVID-19. And so she wouldn't be able to start teaching yet. You know, reasonably, Needy was disappointed, but she understood because there was this global pandemic happening. But as she was waiting for the classes to begin, the scammers asked her to download some software that would allegedly be needed for her upcoming classes. And one of the programs she was asked to install is called TeamViewer, which will allow the scammers to access files on her laptop by posing as IT. And I want to be clear here because TeamViewer is a legitimate software program. IT departments use it all the time, but of course, your IT department doesn't have an ulterior motive. At least you hope you don't. Exactly. At least we hope not. During this time, the scammers also played off Needy's eagerness to connect with faculty members as she was waiting for when she would be given the okay to begin teaching her class. In fact, on multiple occasions, the scammers invited her to do a video call with Emma Dench, a real dean at Harvard till this day. But of course, the scammers weren't actually connected with the real Emma Dench, and so the calls kept getting canceled at the last minute, each with a more ridiculous excuse. On one occasion, she was told that the dean had to rush out to deal with a faculty suicide. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01 32:24

I feel like I don't even know what to say to that. Like, it's one of those things that it's just this is fundamentally so cruel. You know? Like a lot of the scams we've discussed are for the enrichment of the person and it's evil, but this is particularly like humiliating and cruel, you know? It is, and I've still not discovered what the scammers stands to gain. So and rarely have we come this far without seeing the gain. Do you see what I'm trying to say? So I'm a little bit like, what are we doing here?

SPEAKER_03 33:00

You know? So we are getting to the point where the other shoe drops, unfortunately. Right. And so Needy waits through the pandemic delays until finally, in the middle of the night, in January 2021, out of pure frustration and the fact that she hadn't been paid for months. And remember, she's already quit her previous job, and I don't know what it's been four months, you know, of not being paid. Right. She emails Dean Emma Dench's actual real life Harvard office asking about the canceled videos. And that's where everything comes crashing down. An associate dean writes back a devastating sentence. There is no record of nor any knowledge of your name or your appointment.

SPEAKER_01 33:59

Wow. I feel like that kind of confirmation is so gut-wrenching. So you've quit your high-profile job, you've announced this new job to the world, you've not been paid for months, none of it is real. That has to mess with your brain a little bit. You're like, am I on a TV show? Like, what do you even believe to be true? And I feel like also there is this finality with which I feel like Western bureaucracies or bureaucratic offices tend to deliver information. Like there is no record of you. I don't know who you are. I feel like I would expect, you know, some, you know, give us a call, let's figure out what's going on. They're just like, we don't know who you are. Girl, figure it out. And Ugo, I know I've said this a couple of times, but what is the motive here? I feel like typically for the scams we've done, there's an exchange of money, right? This is what we're trying to do. But unless I missed it, you've not said anything about them taking money. It's giving for the love of the game. Like, what are we doing this for? What is going on?

SPEAKER_03 35:09

For the love of the game, it's hilarious. I mean, just because just because honestly, it's giving certified hater behavior. But you were right, like it wasn't financially motivated. In a blog post that Needy later wrote, she explicitly says that no one ever asked her for money. She had handed over her passport, medical records, and her banking details, but her bank account was never touched. They didn't try to drain her funds or hold her data for ransom. The answer we're looking for seems to be in the digital forensics. After the scam unraveled, Needy hired a cybersecurity firm to examine her laptop and the software that she was, you know, asked to download. And I mentioned Team Viewer earlier, and this software unfortunately ended up giving the scammers full access to her device. The cybersecurity firm found suspicious files that were placed on her laptop, and one of those files contained an IP address that had previously been associated with Pakistani intelligence.

SPEAKER_01 36:18

So now we're thinking, okay, this could be a targeted campaign by a foreign state actor. Initially I thought, because I know you'd mentioned the earlier potential or earlier almost near victims were Indian, were outspoken critics of the Indian government. So maybe that's who was doing it, but it's giving very much spy kids, and I kind of find it very difficult. It just feels really far-fetched. Like I find it very difficult to believe that the Pakistani or Indian governments have to do all this just to get to you, because they really don't. So I don't think they would spend their time doing that, right?

SPEAKER_03 36:58

Right. So apparently there are three main theories concerning this case. The first two theories are related to your point just now, right? Remember to our listeners, these women have been very vocal in the political sphere, including as it concerned the Indian government. They had targets on their back, essentially. And Rohini in particular suspects that this was the doing of the Indian government in hopes of embarrassing and sidelining these journalists. But from what I know, not everyone actually agrees that the Indian government did this for a few reasons. And one of this is because at least one of the victims impacted by these scammers actually supports the current Indian government. And two, there are some experts who believe that it was a foreign state actor aiming to infiltrate the devices of highly connected Indian media and political figures. Now, the third theory is that this was a lone wolf, an individual troll.

SPEAKER_01 38:02

Right. And you said she was dealing with a lot of online trolls already, right? It's giving our certified hater theory might be correct.

SPEAKER_00 38:10

Oh no.

SPEAKER_03 38:11

Honestly, it might be because there was a Twitter account under the name of Seema Singh that identified herself as a coder and claimed that she was based in Barat, which apparently is another name for India that is preferred by nationalists who see India as a colonial term. And Seema sent sexually aggressive messages tagging Zainab and some of the other women targeted in the scam. And she was publicly harassing the targeted women online, commenting on things like their views on the Hindu-Muslim divide. And the technical findings support the lone wolf theory too, because the Twitter accounts of both Tosif and Alex were found to be linked to a single Samsung Galaxy S8 phone.

SPEAKER_01 38:58

Yeah, like all of these are pretty unnerving, but I feel like the single phone it seems like very clear evidence that the lone wolf theory is most likely and super like just it just makes me really uncomfortable because it makes the most sense, right? Like it is pretty lofty to think this is government surveillance, but the whole thing about like IP address, is it? I mean, I'm not the most tech sound girl, but is IP address just where you click it from? So if I stand outside the Pentagon and click on something, what are they gonna be like? I just don't buy that one. I buy this one definitely. And I feel like, you know, you know those old shows like of catfish and some of these like snapped episodes, some of these documentaries. It's this very elaborate cyberbullying of one person. And because it's so detailed, you want to believe it's a government, you want to believe it's like a network of people, but then it's just like the girl that they went to swimming lessons with once in 2005 or something. It's just like somebody that they know that's bored and has nothing better to do that's like trying to harm them, really. Like this is, I don't know what's worse if it's just a hater, you know, an ideologue or a hater that's an ideologue. Oh, I hate it, I hate it so much.

SPEAKER_03 40:32

Yeah, no, the lone wolf theory makes sense to me too, for all the reasons that you just mentioned, but also for one very specific reason, and it's the damn email. It's like it's the Gmail. It was just too not good, right? Right? It was too much of a rookie mistake that if this was some sophisticated intelligence gathering campaign, it just doesn't, it doesn't align.

SPEAKER_01 40:55

It doesn't align.

SPEAKER_03 40:57

For sure.

SPEAKER_02 40:59

For sure.

SPEAKER_01 41:00

I feel like uh I feel like all our episodes so far were able to give a good reason for why somebody would do this, and I just still find it unsettling that the motivation doesn't seem fully clear. Like, was anybody ever charged for this ultimately?

SPEAKER_03 41:21

Unfortunately, no one has ever been found and charged with a crime for the scam.

SPEAKER_01 41:27

No, oh no.

SPEAKER_03 41:30

What I do have to offer you is that several of the Twitter accounts linked to the scam were suspended. So Tosa is out of the Tulsa.

SPEAKER_01 41:40

Don't let me catch you on these Twitter streams. Oh, this was a juicy Ugo. I feel like so many moving pieces in this story, and my heart goes out to Niddy because she doesn't really have any closure, right? Like you don't really know who just took all these months of your life away from you and put, you know, subjected you to this humiliation. Oh, it's an awful, awful story. But I mean to bring it back to the listener, what should people take away? What should they be, I guess, watching for?

SPEAKER_03 42:15

Before I pivot to what our listeners should take away, I do want to note that it seems like Nady has very much bounced back from this. I went onto her Twitter page, which is still up. She is standing tall at 1 million Twitter followers and she is teaching at a university currently. I believe the university is in India though. Excellent. Okay. Yes. Okay, good. But to your point about what our listeners should take away from this, I think they should take away to be a skeptic, right? And not in a paranoid way, but in a in a deliberate, thoughtful way. This story really shows us how easy it is for credibility to be manufactured. When something comes from a name like Harvard, there is an instinct to trust it immediately, to assume that legitimacy is built in. But that's exactly what the scammers were relying on, right? At the end of the day, no logo, no email signature, no job title replaces basic verification. If something matters, especially something that could change your life, you have to slow down and confirm it yourself. That means going to official sources and reaching out directly. Because no one's gonna do that due diligence for you. Remember, lots of administrative paperwork doesn't mean legitimacy. And I think that this is especially important right now, given the current labor markets, at least here in the US. A lot of people are navigating layoffs, and when you're in that position, an opportunity like this feels like relief. And scammers understand that emotional context. That's why we're seeing more fake job. Postings, more fake recruiters, and even fake interviews. It can be about collecting your personal data, gaining access to your devices, collecting your banking details, or something else.

SPEAKER_01 44:14

Yeah, and I feel like what you just said about the paperwork, and like I said before, almost like weaponized boredom. That's actually a learning for me. Because I'm very big on if you're rushing me, I'm already out. Like I will not be rushed if I feel like oh, this has to get done today. So I know that by default, I'm biased towards when there's like paperwork, things for me to look through. It's almost like a false sense of security, you know? And now I'm like, oh my god, that's not good enough. I'm definitely like double checking every opportunity from now on because this is one of those things that just reminds you it's not about how long it actually takes, it's still about the content of the thing, you know.

SPEAKER_03 44:58

Absolutely, as you should, because these days that congratulations email might just be your undoing. Scam scam.

SPEAKER_02 45:11

Scam scam.

SPEAKER_01 45:17

All right, today's scam scam comes to us from Instagram. So it's like we're in the social media streets this episode, and it's actually honestly one of those ones that is freakishly good. So Instagram user handle oh hack no, which is really a hacking awareness type of Instagram account. It's really good, so you guys should go ahead and follow them. But they received an extremely realistic reset your password email from Instagram, right? And they're showing this email. Ugo when I tell you it is fantastic. Reset your password. The formatting is exactly as any email you've gotten from Instagram in the past that was legitimate. The official email address that they used to send it is valid. Security at mail.instagram.com. This is the actual email address that that um you know Instagram would send you those types of emails from. And apparently they had a breach, which is why this was possible. So your sender domain is correct, right? So you're already my guard would have been down. The body of the email, not a thing out of place. Typically, the scammers, some of these scam emails, they like misspell things here and there. Yeah, not the case in this one. Even the footnotes, you know, copyright Instagram, and it says the whole thing perfectly correct. What these scammers want you to do is click on the link to reset your password. However, what you should do, which is what she did do, is to go to your Instagram account and go to your settings. You'll see a section password and security, and then to click recent emails. It'll make you probably sort of sign in again, you know, two-factor authentication, all of that stuff. And then you can see the emails that Instagram sent to you. Oh wow. Right? So that was a thing. It's a thing. You should definitely do that. Like off rip, if you get an email, especially if it's asking for information, like reset your password, verify your password, verify your email address, things like that. You should go to the social media account, go to your own app, and check that they sent you that email. And all of the accounts have this Instagram, TikTok, you know, Twitter, I guess we should call it X, right? But anyway, right. Um, they all have it where they show you under password and security the recent emails they sent to you. You want to guess? Do you want to guess if Instagram sent her an email? Of course not. Of course not. Instagram was like, yeah, we haven't sent you anything, girl. And but no, yeah, go ahead. No, I was just saying, like, and she would have clicked the link and been, you know, given her entire password and Instagram information to a bad actor. Basically.

SPEAKER_03 48:39

Honestly, this makes me nervous because I have for sure received those Instagram reset your password emails just like at like random times. And I wouldn't fall for them because I didn't even deeply interrogate the emails because I was like, well, I know that I didn't click to reset my password. That's so the fact that I'm receiving this is just weird. Now, what I usually do is I might just change my password, not clicking the link, just go into my Instagram account and change my password because I'm like, I don't know what's going on here. But that is unnerving that it was so spot on and so detailed. But I love the fact that you can go onto your social media accounts and see the emails that they have sent you. I did not know that.

SPEAKER_01 49:26

Yes, yes. And the thing is, if you made a request to reset your password, then that's way more valid. And you know, you can go ahead and follow that. But when you get these random reset your password, verify your email types of emails into your inbox, it's more than likely not authentic. Because what they're hoping is that you heard, oh, Instagram had a breach and everybody should just reset their passwords and they sent the emails around anyway, it's probably not true. So you should go again into the app and check. And something else that she said in the video, which is very, very true. If you do not have two-factor authenticator on, please stop being silly. Go authenticate that thing twice. Authenticate it twice, girl, maybe even three times. It's actually very, very, very important because these things are so hard to reclaim if they get hacked. It takes so much work to get it fixed. So that's my scam scam of the day. My girl didn't get scammed, and I have to make sure you guys know as well. So if you see anything like that, always go check your recent emails. It's so quick, it's so worth doing to avoid the pain of handing over your password to somebody that you do not know.

SPEAKER_03 50:43

And as we always say, pause, take your time and do your own verification. 100%.

SPEAKER_01 50:52

If you have a local scam from anywhere in the world that happened to you, your parents, your in-laws, even that girl at work you don't really like, whether the scam was just an attempt or if it was even successful, we would love to hear about it and maybe even read it out loud in this segment. So please send it to us at info at unnigerianprints.com. Thank you all for sticking with us. We will see you next time in another.